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Odd Flowsheet Mapping for Minute Ventilation and Urinary Tube Output

We’ve begun expanding our mapping of flowsheet information into our OMOP database. Most are straight forward, but Minute Ventilation (L/min) and Urinary Tube Output (mL) only have the standard concept codes of 397802005 and 365678000, respectively. The domain for these codes is Condition. We did not find any matching concept for these data in Measurement. Is there a measurement equivalent. If not, how should these values be recorded in Conditions?

Hello @WustlRob,

For urine output I would use one of the children of concept_id = 4227850.The children include concepts for 24 hour, 6 hour and hourly output.

In regards to the Minute Ventilation, I can’t find a good match, so I will let the vocabulary gurus chime in. However, I do have a question. What’s the use case for Minute Ventilation (L/min)?

Also, the N3C group has mapped supplemental oxygen to the CDM. You might want to check out the work they have done.

Hi @MPhilofsky,

Thanks for the information. I’ll check into what the N3C group is doing. As for the MV, I’m not entirely sure of the use case. This is for ICU patients and has a COVID-19 perspective. My non-clinical guess is looking at ventilator rates for covid vs. non-covid patients? But that’s just a wild guess.

Hi @WustlRob

For Urine output I would use LOINC 9187-6 Urine output or concepts suggested by Melanie - they are very specific depending on your use case.

And for Minute ventilation you cannot use Ventilator rates as a substitution, because minute ventilation depends on respiratory rate and respiratory volume. I would suggest this concept to you: Minute volume.

Hi @zhuk,

Minute Volume looks like an excellent match. I’ll present these to our clinical team members and confirm that these will work. Thanks so much to you and Melanie! :medal_sports:

My not so wild guess, former ICU RN and very familiar with these data at the bedside, through the EHR, into the CDM, and as a research variable, is this variable won’t be used :slight_smile:

Please ignore the following unrequested advice as needed :slight_smile: Don’t boil the ocean. There are thousands of recorded variables in the ICU. In Colorado we mapped ~125 supplemental oxygen variables to OMOP. And these are only supplemental oxygen, not any of the attributes associated with each distinctive type of supplemental oxygen present in our source data. I probably spent 50 hours deconstructing the use case to identify what source data were necessary, identifying the data at the source, reviewing the way those data were store and with which variables, semantically mapping the data to standard concept_ids, writing specifications for how to field map these source data, information & code reviews, QA, and UAT.

@MPhilofsky - This is very helpful. Translating knowledge between clinical and technical people is an indispensable skill. Thanks for your insight!